Totaly engine fail - 2.0 Turbo - AWD Regal 2016 AWD- Same as GM - Cadillac ATS

[saleen90181]

Its a total engine fail due to a know issue (Cadi guys know the issue )- car is down for at least a month in my PO

I have an issue - car didn't make it off the lot when i bought it - failed PS rack

Then failed again PS rack - recall - down a week

Then Failed again - sensors - power - ECU

Failed 4 times with right front tire pressure - the wheel is cracked but they wont admit it

Looking to lemon law it I think

A car with less then 6000 miles on it - did not make if off the lot the day it was bought - has 4 document times that the front tire and suspension has an issue, reported motor power issues in last service, and now has launched entire motor - cly 2 at least and 4 has a major issue

SO GM is aware of this issue - Caddie guys complaining to GM - i am sure more Buick will add in the future

Not a lot of Buick guys have a AWD Turbo 2015/2016 2.0T - not a lot sold - and GM wont give us production numbers

i hope GM/Buick/GM sees this- but here is a vid
it's extremely common on the 2.0T, total stock long block - heads, upper and lower, injectors, heads, exhaust, turbo, inter cooler, so on - even running 92 gas


[url]http://www.cadillacforums.com/forums/cadillac-ats-performance-forum/613529-2-0t-bad-pistons-roll-call.html

[/URL]

Its stock - it has the stock upper/lower intake manifolds - stock MAF -stock Throttle body - stock heads - stock injectors - stock trans - stock heads - stock Turbo - its the same as the Caddie ATS - same heads - same stock exhaust - same config


https://youtu.be/V2VFH9_3hcA

Its at the dealer - its blown up that they told me - replacement motor requested

I might have to rethink keeping the GM and going back to Ford

 

[stoopid]

I started a thread about this before I tuned mine. It seemed they got the situation under control or it was something specific to the config/implementation in the ATS.

http://buickforums.com/forums/threads/39842-Tuning-2-0T-reliability-issues

There's some links to various things, including the TSB for the Cadillac PI-1178, which I don't see why it wouldn't apply to anyone using the 2.0T (?).

Hopefully they get you in a decent rental while you wait and everything gets sorted for you in the end.

 

[tygriff]

Any idea of how many Regal failures there are for this? Is it related to AWD (I don't see how it could be)?

I am getting a little nervous about my 2015 Turbo FWD. I am going to have to read up more on this failure mode.

Does anyone know if its a design flaw / material spec issue? GM makes a lot of 2.0L turbos, and this is the first I have heard of this.

 

[stoopid]

From what I could find, it seems rare (at best/worse) with the Regals. For whatever reason, issue seems more rampant among ATS owners. As I posted in my other thread, I spoke with someone with intimate knowledge working with the engine and they say the issue has happened whether stock or tuned. That would indicate a flaw, likely not in the pistons themselves but in the implementation of some related engine component. If it was strictly piston weakness then we would be seeing equal numbers of Regals, Malibus, and now Camaros failing. One theory that I read floating around was that something in the way the engine is mounted/configured and turbo is connected in the ATS might be causing fluids to get washed back through the turbo and/or manifold. That extra fluid seeps into the top of the piston through the valves and causes an imbalance of pressure which is why the damage to the pistons is happening near the top/rings. Until GM formally releases something we really won't know for certain. The TSB I referenced above deals with the symptoms and repair, it doesn't cite cause.

I read A LOT about this but that was many months ago and unfortunately I didn't log all the sites I visited. Some of that info was found on the ATS forums though, so I encourage people to follow the bread crumbs over there.

 

[stoopid]

It should also be noted that pushing 260hp/295tq from a 2 liter engine is quite a feat of engineering, and I often wonder if we're not living a touch too close to the bleeding edge.

 

[NHRATA01]

It should also be noted that pushing 260hp/295tq from a 2 liter engine is quite a feat of engineering, and I often wonder if we're not living a touch too close to the bleeding edge.

Eh, the LNF/LHU's have been pretty rock solid for years at that power, even the older Cobalt SS/Kappa cars with that 300hp factory tune package.

If you think 260 is a lot, consider that Mercedes AMG 2.0T is making 365!

 

[stoopid]

Eh, the LNF/LHU's have been pretty rock solid for years at that power, even the older Cobalt SS/Kappa cars with that 300hp factory tune package.

If you think 260 is a lot, consider that Mercedes AMG 2.0T is making 365!

I hear ya, just *seems* like a lot to expect out of such a small amount of displacement. Supposedly the 300hp/340tq tune I have is a relatively 'safe' tune, and that more could likely be gained (even with just stock components). When they barely get 150hp NA from the same displacement, that seems like a giant leap.

 

[TRNDRVR]

Hmm! I've got a 2016 2.0T AWD Regal.

I only have about 2200 miles on it though. 🤔

 

[RegalGSLover]

It should also be noted that pushing 260hp/295tq from a 2 liter engine is quite a feat of engineering, and I often wonder if we're not living a touch too close to the bleeding edge.

It is impressive but the GM LNF engine is rock solid and one of the best engines ever made. I bet all these failures are from bad batches of pistons.

I had a 2011 Chevy Cruze that had 3 of 4 cracked pistons and had the engine replaced.

I am currently at 20K on my 2012 Buick Regal with a Trifecta Tune and not a single issue.

Just really bad luck from the start for the OP.

 

[stoopid]

It is impressive but the GM LNF engine is rock solid and one of the best engines ever made.

I'm betting on this and my research, as I'd like to keep the tune and enjoy the vehicle for a few more years.

 

[zanethan]

I might have to rethink keeping the GM and going back to Ford

100% agree! I've been very disappointed with the build quality of my GS. Granted I haven't had anything serious break on mine, the fact that the end of my warranty is coming up and its been in the dealer 6 times in less than a year doesn't inspire confidence on my end.

Not to mention the squeaks! The squeaks, squeaks, squeaks!

 

[saleen90181]

Just for an update - the car is in pieces at this point and i seen it

#2 - failed compression ring

#4 - failed compression and oil rings

both hairline cracks - no sleave damage

But tons of metal in the oil -

Going to replace all pistions - maybe turbo - all gaskets - and look what ever they can also replace under warrentee - everything and anything

since they remeber car didnt make it off the lot when I got it - they are going the extra mile

Front rim with leak - looks like I am getting a new rim

Buick CS really came threw - but hell these cars should last longer - or at least make if of the lot with out being broke - then come back 4 times being broke - then blow the motor to all hell before the first oil change

keep you guys updated - said it will be at least a week before I see it again - and it looked like a real PITA from the parts they dropped already - trans - exhaust - total top end - computer - interior

Not really happy that when i get it back its really not a new car any more - but hell - its covered

 

[stoopid]

Thanks for the update! Glad they're going to repair everything.

Your experience is obviously far from the norm for Buick owners. Hopefully this will be a lifetime's worth of problems and the car is problem free herein.

 

[saleen90181]

Thanks for the update! Glad they're going to repair everything.

Your experience is obviously far from the norm for Buick owners. Hopefully this will be a lifetime's worth of problems and the car is problem free herein.

My Luck My friend - my luck -

 

[SLOWREGAL]

Believe me The build quality on these Regals is Garbage. I have had 9 warranty repairs in 9 months. My car has been down for two months total time.

I have a Stage One 2013 GS witg the LHU. Motor is fine maybe but I can feel the trans slip, and currently the engineers of the stage kit are startig an investigation into the problems my car is having... I only have 27k and have had problems since I bought it with 18k

Crap cars.... Hey remember how awesome the last regal gs was....

 

[BNRacing]

The LHU is a damn fine motor, we've tuned a ton of them and even have one running 110 octane making 350HP/380TQ at the wheels, and it gets raced every weekend and runs like a champ. 2014+ Regals get the LTG, same engine as the ATS/Malibu and now the 2.0 Camaro. I cannot for the life of me figure out why they put these motors in these cars still. There's no recall, they all have the same part numbers still, nothing has been redesigned, and it's a major flaw that they've admitted to on the ATS. Get it together GM.

In the mean time, for those that want to get rid of the problem forever, we did just come out with forged CP-Carrillo made pistons and rods for this motor. They aren't on the site yet but they're in our test ATS now.

 

[wungun]

It should also be noted that pushing 260hp/295tq from a 2 liter engine is quite a feat of engineering, and I often wonder if we're not living a touch too close to the bleeding edge.

Not really, when you're talking about boosted engines. Normally aspirated 2.0 at that power level would require serious Rpm and the related stresses and wear involved... Which can be a LOT more than just 20psi boost and 6000rpm.

 

[NHRATA01]

saleen I would really push hard for them to replace the longblock. All that metal in the oil, who knows what got into the main and rod bearings, and top end.

 

[dbruce]

Found the following thread on a Camaro board. Seems an update is supposed to resolve the pre-ignition on the engines. The engine has, supposedly, been revised for the Camaro (and possibly other cars......though no details in that thread how.

http://www.camaro6.com/forums/showthread.php?t=413887

 

[stoopid]

Found the following thread on a Camaro board. Seems an update is supposed to resolve the pre-ignition on the engines. The engine has, supposedly, been revised for the Camaro (and possibly other cars......though no details in that thread how.

http://www.camaro6.com/forums/showthread.php?t=413887

Good discussion, mentioning some of what I found but also a more detailed description of the TSB for the Cadillac ATS:

Subject: 14591 - Piston Damage Due To Engine Misfire

Models: 2013 Cadillac ATS

2013 Chevrolet Malibu

Equipped with 2.0L 4 Cylinder Engine (LTG)

THIS PROGRAM IS IN EFFECT UNTIL DECEMBER 31, 2016.

Condition

Certain 2013 model year Cadillac ATS and Chevrolet Malibu model vehicles equipped with a 2.0L 4

Cylinder Engine (LTG) may have a condition in which piston damage could occur due to an engine

pre-ignition condition. If this condition occurs, the vehicle may perform poorly and oil

Consumption

could increase. A warning light may illuminate indicating an engine misfire. If this

repair is not completed before multiple pre-ignition events occur, the piston may be damaged and

the engine may need to be rebuilt or replaced.

Correction

Dealers are to reprogram the Engine Control Module (ECM) with a revised spark control

calibration, install spark plugs with a colder heat range (required with the new calibration) and

place an update to the spark plug part number information located in the "Maintenance

Replacement Parts" found in Section 11 of the Owner Manual. GM will mall the Owner Manual

supplement to customers of record.

Vehicles Involved

All involved vehicles are Identified by Vehicle Identification Number on the Investigate Vehicle

History screen In GM Global Warranty Management system. Dealership service personnel should

always check this site to confirm vehicle involvement prior to beginning any required inspections

and/or repairs. It is important to routinely use this tool to verify eligibility because not all similar

vehicles may be involved regardless of description or option content.

For dealers with involved vehicles, a listing with involved vehicles containing the complete vehicle

identification number, customer name, and address information has been prepared and will be

provided to US and Canadian dealers through the GM GlobalConnect Recall Reports, or sent

directly to export dealers. Dealers will not have a report available if they have no involved

vehicles currently assigned.

The listing may contain customer names and addresses obtained from Motor Vehicle Registration

Records. The use of such motor vehicle registration data for any purpose other than follow-up

necessary to complete this program is a violation of law in several states/provinces/countries.

Accordingly, you are urged to limit the use of this report to the follow-up necessary to complete

this program.

Parts Information

Parts required to complete this program are to be obtained from General Motors Customer Care

and Aftersales (GMCCA). Please refer to

your

"involved vehicles listing" before ordering parts.

Normal orders should be placed on a DRO = Daily Replenishment Order. In an emergency

situation, parts should be ordered on a CSO = Customer Special Order

- - - Updated - - -

My guess to what happened in this specific instance -- there was water in the gas and caused the pre-ignition under WOT that caused the engine to blow/pistons to fail. By internet measures, most of the problems were in the early LTG (2013-2014). MUCH fewer reported issues with the 2015+ LTG. I suspect it might have been a combination of the new plugs and ECU programming, or improved pistons. It would be great if someone, somewhere confirmed this. Maybe one of the tuners can confirm the ECU programming changes described above between a '13 and '16 LTG?