Make way for 3900? R.I.P. 3800?

[ParkAveUltra]

So is the 3800 canned now for the new 3900?

 

[PFJ5K]

GM has been trying to replace the 3800 for more than decade now, but they just keep making them. As far as I know the 3900 is only available in the G6 GTP. The 3800 is still available in the Lacrosse, Lesabre, Bonneville, Impala and Monte Carlo.

I highly doubt that GM will put the 3900 in all of their large cars anytime soon. Ultimately GM will replace the supercharged 3800 with v8s like in the Grand Prix and Bonneville and use either the 3900 or 3.6 dohc as the base engine in their large cars. I'm guessing that you'll still be able to get a 3800 for the next 3 or 4 years, but eventually it will be phased out.

 

[Unregistered]

Still using that unrefined 3800 series?

Why is GM still using that 3800 series V6? It's unrefined, old school, and a POS. How does GM expect to compete in the 21st century when it is still using an old pushrod engine from what, the 1950s? One of the reasons I have a hard time accepting GM cars is because its products just aren't as good as Toyota or Honda.

Get a clue GM. Start putting some modern DOHC engines into your cars. Don't you have a nice VVT engine? Start using it.

 

[Liberty Buick #!]

The 3800 will be the standard engine in the Lucerne, so it will be around for a while. Why fix something thats not broke, that engine gets great gas mileage, tell me one car as big as the Park Ave. that gets 29 mpg on the hwy? You might want to check J.D Powers and you will find the Buick is more reliable than the Toyota or Honda.

 

[ParkAveUltra]

3800 Series, best V6 ever made, given price, reliablilty, gas mileage. Plus they have loads of torque and plenty of HP, perfect for day to day. My opinion on them. I love how you can tap the key to start, and the engine is running before the key returns. Smooth and quiet! 🙂

 

[jacksmith]

If it ain't broke then don't fix it?

I would rather have the GM 3.8 than the 3.1. I keep hearing of problems with the Intake manifold on the 3.1 at around 50,000 miles.

The 3.8 is an enigne. If it is strong and reliable and you can't hear it in the passenger cab then who cares? My Buick Riv 87 has the 3.8 and with 125,000 miles it purrs like a kitchen.

If you want a Ferrari then buy one!

 

[Unregistered]

Why fix something thats not broke, that engine gets great gas mileage, tell me one car as big as the Park Ave. that gets 29 mpg on the hwy? You might want to check J.D Powers and you will find the Buick is more reliable than the Toyota or Honda.

Well said, like a car dealership. First, I realize that Buick is GM's better reliable brand, but that J.D. Power and Associates survey you point to is their Initial Quality Study, which looks at owner-reported problems in the first 90 days of ownership. In the first 90 days, your new car better have zero problems. A more relevant survey to consider for the long run is the survey and reliability ratings done by Consumer Reports, and Buick is not up there with Toyota.

Regarding the fuel efficiency of the 3800 V6, let me give you this comparison:

Buick LaCrosse gets 20/29 (EPA) with the 3800 Series III at 200 hp;
Toyota Avalon gets 22/31 (EPA) with a 3.5-liter DOHC 24-valve Dual VVT-i V6 at 280 hp

The LaCrosse and Avalon both weigh about 3,500 lbs; the Avalon gets better gas mileage with more power and a more modern engine. I'm sure you will point this out to your next customer interested in the LaCrosse that comes into your showroom. So do you want to keep pushing that GM's old style 3800 Series V6 is more fuel efficient than more modern engines?

Look, I will buy a LaCrosse over an Avalon anyday. As I said in another thread, I buy American (or North American when it comes to cars). I just don't let my preferences and biases blind me to the facts.

 

[Unregistered]

I'll take the old unrefined GM 3800 push rod engine any day over a piece of crap OHC one.The 3800 is the one of the best engines ever built.They sure have gotten the job done for us for many years now.I've gotten great mileage with them without a minutes trouble.

 

[Unregistered]

3800 Rules

I'm right there with ya. Gladly take the 3800 engine over anything else. I've owned 5 cars with this engine and they ALL have went over 200K miles. I had two where the transmissions went far before the engines ever will. Anyway, I own a new Park Avenue Ultra with the supercharged 3800 in it. It is my first s/charged version of this engine and I absolutely love it. It gets good gas mileage has plenty of power and operates very quitely. I'm with the dealer that wrote, "Why fix it if it isn't broke."

My thoughts are that GM wants to pahse out the 3800 engine becuase they aren't making enough money off of them in repairs. Typical GM actions would show that once they make something good and reliable they phase it out. Look at how many vehicles have these engines in them from Olds 88s & 99s to Bonnevilles, LeSabres, Park Avenues, Impalla, Monte Carlo's etc. There are a slew of these out there and many people (including myself) will only buy a car that has a 3800 under the hood.

 

[Unregistered]

No innovation with "Why fix something that's not broke"

I will agree that the 3800 Series V6 is probably very reliable, since GM has been making it since the ice age. I will not agree with this idea of "Why fix something that's not broke." You get no innovation with an attitude that is essentially anti-change. Businesses that have that attitude lose market share and get killed by their competitors. Sound familiar? Just look at GM's market share decline in North America. That is exactly why GM has to resort to desparate marketing tactics like the 24-hour test drive program with a $250 giveaway (if you buy a car other than GM) and the employee discount for everyone.

You see, with an attitude like that, foreign automakers just have to design a more innovative car, build it with the highest quality in North America and the American consumer will buy that instead of GM. Sound familiar? That's what's happening right now.

The "Why fix something that's not broke" attitude is a death sentence in today's competitive global market.

 

[93Roadmyster]

I had 2 cars with over 200K on them that had 3800s The engine was the only part of the car that I trusted. You could almost completely run the engine out of oil and drive it for a week without any ill effects. An OHC engine would self destruct if you abused it like that. Another drawback to moving into newer technologies is that it becomes increasingly more difficult to do your own repairs. If you are already familiar with the 231 as it sat in a Regal in the 70s it isn't too much of a stretch to figure one out after they turned it sideways and added fuel injection.
I'm not opposed to GM developing new technology, but there is something to be said for sticking to the old reliable.

 

[RegalLover]

Drive it till it dies..

I know I came in a little late on this discussion. But I have to agree with all the 3800 lovers. We run a taxi service here and have tried every vehicle you can think of to last the longest from 4 bangers to v-8. Even down to the POS 3400 DOHC that GM has decided to put in their cars. It has got to be the worst motor , Our first one made it to 165,000 and then died.. We thought ok just a lemon. The next one didnt make it that far. We have been using the 3800 for about 7 years now and get almost 300,000 mi or better out of them . So for those who think build newer technology with ohc and dohc , Been there done that and they dont last. We now will only drive Lesabre or Park Ave. Think they need to keep old reliable around a while longer till they can do something right again..

 

[ParkAveUltra]

Production of the renowned 3800 V6 engine is unofficially scheduled to cease before summer's end of 2008. Originally GM had set this date for January 1, 1999, however due to the vast number of complaints from both investors and customers because of the popularity and reliability of the engine, the date was extended. At the end of production, the LZ4 3500 OHV V6 will replace the naturally aspirated 3800 applications, and the LY7 3600 DOHC V6 will replace the supercharged 3800 applications.

 

[donovan1983]

This is really sad news. I am amazed by how good the 3800 is. My car rolled out of the factory 11 1/2 years ago, the original owner did just the required maintenance, it has never had a tuneup, and the thing averages 22 to 23 MPG for mostly short trips in the city. That's with the climate control on and a driver that regularly takes advantage of the response a generous push of the accelerator gives. When I went up to Central City via a winding, rather steep highway I was getting over 26 MPG and trips to Loveland (the city) get me 30MPG or more. I have to crank it over for barely a second before the engine starts except on the coldest of days. I don't care about what horsepower and torque specs say, this engine moves the 5500lbs net weight of my 97 LeSabre effortlessly and those who have driven my car have commented on how surprisingly powerful it is. It has V8-like power and smoothness with small V6-like fuel economy.

I was figuring that when I get ready to replace this car with something new I'd still go for a Buick with a 3800 in it. But with this news, I'll have to look at a late model used one. Or I can just keep the LeSabre since I know that mechanically it will last for a very long time. I don't care about how flashy the specs are on an engine and I'd much rather have a proven, reliable design than something that just looks better on paper but performs worse in use. I'm sure GM will be able to sell more Buicks with Northstar V8s in them after they stop using the 3800 and that is likely what they are trying to do.

 

[98BuickRegalGS]

3800 has to be one of GM's Best Made Engines I know it's time for some Change but you can never say the 3800 was a bad motor it was an great motor they proved that with the Series III Super Charged Engines 260 hp and 280lbs of torque and still get 28 Miles per Gallon dumb part on GM to get rid of the 3800 motor

 

[Buffman]

I like comments earlier in this thread about pushrods being old technology. HELLO OHC motors came before pushrods.

 

[98BuickRegalGS]

know what you're actually right OHC and DOHC's have been around longer then the push rods since the 1920's and Fiat was the first to use the DOHC motors in all there cars in the 60's

 

[Clinton70]

lol at the negative comments from the guest. I really don't care if the Avalon get's better EPA on paper. In real life I get 33mpg on the highway, more than the Avalon's 29. I probably do better than my Mom's '08 Accord 3.5 and I need a tranny oil change and new spark plugs/wires soon.

 

[Redkees]

I am very happy with my 3800 V6 in my 2006 LaCrosse. Damm that engine
has guts and is so smooth and quiet. This car is a keeper. For a car its size to get 30 mpg on the highway is pretty damm good.
I agree with all previous posters--this engine is the best engine GM ever made.
Years ago my Dad had one and that car ran 350K miles. In fact the tranny gave out before the engine.

 

[chevyboy6902]

Hey but at least my GM wont unexpectedly speed up to 100 miles per hour like many toyotas on the road today. whoops guess those jap tin cans are not as innovative as everyone once thought. I have more faith in my wifes 00 buick then my mazda anyday screw the global economy