stalling issues

[bigblue]

Hi All,

I have always had really good luck on forums so I am trying now for a good friend. She has an 2000 LeSabre that has ran great for years until now. She was coming home from work last week and it died on the way home and had to have it towed to a close local shop. They ran a diagnostic check computer for code; this came back negative. they cleared computer for codes & tried to recreate stalling. The car started without issue, idled and ran well on two test drives. No problems found. She picked it up and drove (about 5 miles) to work, started after work , drove 5 or 6 miles to go home & it stalled (died) again in the same spot. She had it towed to the same place. Money is a real issue because she dosn't have it to get into any "real issue" that may be not worth it. Now, today she picked up the car and I asked she get a list of everything they checked and it was vauge to say the least. this list contained the common test drive, flooded, monitor engine data. Over the phone when she talk to them they said they check all the common issues that anyone would say like fuel pump, catalytic converter, starter, alternator. It is hard to say if they checked these issues. now, she picked it up tonight and she said idled hard and ran fine intill she had to stop at a stop light. At a stop sign it was fine but when she had to stop & wait at a light & take off it would sputter on the take off. Once it was going it was fine again. The car doesnt seem to have the power it once had as well. I am not sure if this is part of the issue but the last 3 weeks you can smell antifreeze. She is on a budget and could you all of your opions. Thanks again for your help.

 

[Spriteman]

Okay - bigblue,

When you first started describing the problem I was thinking either a bad fuel pump or some other part of the fuel delivery system or a bad spark via either bad plugs, wires, ignition coils, or ignition module.

However, when you began talking about antifreeze that brings up another whole possibility. Is you friends Lesabre an Ultra - which would mean it has a supercharger - it will say Ultra right on the back of the car.

I am assuming it is NOT an Ultra which means it IS susceptible to a failing intake manifold gasket that allows coolant to get into the intake causing the car to run very rough. This would explain why she's getting coolant smell. Check the coolant level in the overflow tank - is there any in there?

Next check the radiator when the engine is cool - can you see any coolant?

If it is very low she probably has the bad intake manifold gasket problem.

There is more to do after that but you need to check the coolant first and then we'll go from there.

If she continues driving it with this problem is could worsen the problem and potentially lock up the engine.

 

[bigblue]

Okay - bigblue,

When you first started describing the problem I was thinking either a bad fuel pump or some other part of the fuel delivery system or a bad spark via either bad plugs, wires, ignition coils, or ignition module.

However, when you began talking about antifreeze that brings up another whole possibility. Is you friends Lesabre an Ultra - which would mean it has a supercharger - it will say Ultra right on the back of the car.

I am assuming it is NOT an Ultra which means it IS susceptible to a failing intake manifold gasket that allows coolant to get into the intake causing the car to run very rough. This would explain why she's getting coolant smell. Check the coolant level in the overflow tank - is there any in there?

Next check the radiator when the engine is cool - can you see any coolant?

If it is very low she probably has the bad intake manifold gasket problem.

There is more to do after that but you need to check the coolant first and then we'll go from there.

If she continues driving it with this problem is could worsen the problem and potentially lock up the engine.

okay here is where we are at today...

the car is not an ultra & she is not driving it. I called the company that worked on it and got all the info. The car is at my house so I did check the coolant when I got home. I checked the radiator & it was full however it was the color of rust. The overflow tank had about 1/4" full and was also rust in color. I guess here boyfriend "topped" off the overflow about a month ago. I called the company that she had it towed to and here is what they said: fuel pressure & relay tested good, spake test weak, coolant contamination on spark plugs and they also took part of the intake manifold apart to get up there with a mirror to look at the upper plantum (no idea how to spell that). they cleaned plugs (white crust) and it worked fine. I have this guy I work with who ran a shop for 25 years and he says ignition moduel, crank senser or fuel pump. He also said that anti-freeze on the plugs would look like they steam cleaned the plugs. Then he says that a fuel pressure test is useless inless you test the PSI or something. I am still trying to help her save bigblue so thanks again for your help. Lets just assume she did not maintain this car.

- - - Updated - - -

sorry, the overflow was not 1/4 full but had about 1/4" in it.

 

[Spriteman]

Alright - with all of that info I would have to say that she does have the intake manifold gasket failure problem. The fact that the techs found anti-freeze in the spark plugs is the symptom that we usually look for if that is the problem. You could also drain the oil and look for a milky-white appearance - that means the anti-freeze is getting into the crankcase as well.

The fact that the anti-freeze was not very low means that the intake manifold gasket leak has not gotten too big to allow all of the anti-freeze to leak out. That's good because it could get to the point that the anti-freeze filled up the spark cylinders to the point it would lock up the engine completely.

Here's another thread that talks about the problem and gives a couple of links to the parts that are needed to fix it - http://buickforums.com/forums/threads/34706-Leaking-anti-freeze-big-leak?highlight=intake+manifold+gasket


The question is at this point - how much does she want to spend on getting this fixed? The repair bill for this at a local shop would be about $800-$1000. If she knew someone that would be willing to do the work for free if she supplied the parts - she could buy the parts and other supplies it would take to do the work for about $300-$400 depending on how much additional work she wanted to do to make the car run better.

If she doesn't do the work it is just a matter of time before the leak gets bigger and shuts the car down all the way and she'll either have to do the work then - which could be even more $$$ - or buy a new car.

Does she have someone that good with cars who will/can do the work? It's not that hard of a job just a little time consuming.


BTW - the car is definitely worth fixing from our point of view here on the forums and can run for many more years/miles after it's been fixed.